How West Ham became great again

[terrya1965]

He's called a dinosaur on here by many people, many times.

but one step at a time eh? He's turned a disjointed side fighting relegation into a side pushing for a top 6 place in less than 12 months, and you want silverware?

It's up to the fans in the stadium whether the performances we are seeing will be enough to cheer on the players and provide a cup tie atmosphere week in week out. Although given it didn't happen at the Boleyn I suspect it won't happen at the LS.

Silverware is overrated imo. Let's face it the PL trophy is the one that matters. The CL trophy obviously, but that is the preserve of the really big beasts.

For me I'd much rather see us qualify for Europe than, for example win a domestic cup. European qualification should be a recognition that a team is one of it's countries leading representatives, earned by being a consistently good performer throughout the season. To win a cup a team only has to win, what, 5 or 6 matches. FFS these days they don't even have to actually win if their players can take decent penalties. We had to get through 6 games to win the bloody Inter Toto cup FFS and no one ever mentions that.

Tell me what Spurs have got to show for all their "success",over the past 5 years? Absolutely nothing!

They have been the 3rd/4th(with Chelsea) most consistent team in that time,but teams below them in being have won trophies,who have been less steady.Man U have been nowhere near them,apart from this year and they have got 2 in the cabinet.Chelsea,who have been on a similar stage have won the League,FA Cup and the Europa League.

I'm sure Spurs fans would swap that 2016 PL crown(pipped by Leicester),rather than consistency?

You are right,we do need consistency to grow has a club,but we`d all love us to lift a FA or League Cup..I think it would be quite an even vote(in normal circumstances,if fans were attending) to win the FA Cup or get in the CL tbh.Even thought he latter is a better spring board for more success and a lot of the fans would love the away trips.

[Parry Hotter]

He's called a dinosaur on here by many people, many times.

but one step at a time eh? He's turned a disjointed side fighting relegation into a side pushing for a top 6 place in less than 12 months, and you want silverware?

It's up to the fans in the stadium whether the performances we are seeing will be enough to cheer on the players and provide a cup tie atmosphere week in week out. Although given it didn't happen at the Boleyn I suspect it won't happen at the LS.

Silverware is overrated imo. Let's face it the PL trophy is the one that matters. The CL trophy obviously, but that is the preserve of the really big beasts.

For me I'd much rather see us qualify for Europe than, for example win a domestic cup. European qualification should be a recognition that a team is one of it's countries leading representatives, earned by being a consistently good performer throughout the season. To win a cup a team only has to win, what, 5 or 6 matches. FFS these days they don't even have to actually win if their players can take decent penalties. We had to get through 6 games to win the bloody Inter Toto cup FFS and no one ever mentions that.

Make you right. The cups don't mean a thing today and like you say if there ain't a day out at Wembly what's the point.

[Parry Hotter]

Silverware is overrated imo. Let's face it the PL trophy is the one that matters. The CL trophy obviously, but that is the preserve of the really big beasts.

For me I'd much rather see us qualify for Europe than, for example win a domestic cup. European qualification should be a recognition that a team is one of it's countries leading representatives, earned by being a consistently good performer throughout the season. To win a cup a team only has to win, what, 5 or 6 matches. FFS these days they don't even have to actually win if their players can take decent penalties. We had to get through 6 games to win the bloody Inter Toto cup FFS and no one ever mentions that.

Tell me what Spurs have got to show for all their "success",over the past 5 years? Absolutely nothing!

They have been the 3rd/4th(with Chelsea) most consistent team in that time,but teams below them in being have won trophies,who have been less steady.Man U have been nowhere near them,apart from this year and they have got 2 in the cabinet.Chelsea,who have been on a similar stage have won the League,FA Cup and the Europa League.

I'm sure Spurs fans would swap that 2016 PL crown(pipped by Leicester),rather than consistency?

You are right,we do need consistency to grow has a club,but we`d all love us to lift a FA or League Cup..I think it would be quite an even vote(in normal circumstances,if fans were attending) to win the FA Cup or get in the CL tbh.Even thought he latter is a better spring board for more success and a lot of the fans would love the away trips.

Loads of spurs fans where i live and almost all of them loved being in the champs league. One old boy whose been a season ticket holder for bloody years said the best day of his LIFE was the champs league final even though they lost.

[Whiskyman]

Tell me what Spurs have got to show for all their "success",over the past 5 years? Absolutely nothing!

They have been the 3rd/4th(with Chelsea) most consistent team in that time,but teams below them in being have won trophies,who have been less steady.Man U have been nowhere near them,apart from this year and they have got 2 in the cabinet.Chelsea,who have been on a similar stage have won the League,FA Cup and the Europa League.

I'm sure Spurs fans would swap that 2016 PL crown(pipped by Leicester),rather than consistency?

You are right,we do need consistency to grow has a club,but we`d all love us to lift a FA or League Cup..I think it would be quite an even vote(in normal circumstances,if fans were attending) to win the FA Cup or get in the CL tbh.Even thought he latter is a better spring board for more success and a lot of the fans would love the away trips.

Loads of spurs fans where i live and almost all of them loved being in the champs league. One old boy whose been a season ticket holder for bloody years said the best day of his LIFE was the champs league final even though they lost.

I'm surrounded by them too Parry, in fact I know a few ST holders and, to a man, they agree with what you say. One of them actually knows a couple of their players well because he does some taxation work for them and they both told him getting to that final was bigger to them than winning one of the domestic pots. The FA Cup final itself is still a big deal to a lot of fans, it's a good day out on the sauce at least, but to players it's no big deal these days unless you're a non league or lower division player who gets the chance to play against a top team.

Even though you'd probably be playing their second string it's still a challenge and a good day for the fans. But with no fans allowed this season and fixtures needing to be crammed in I don't see why they bothered with the cups this season.

[h69]

What? Hang on, you mean Moyes isn't the dinosaur some profess him to be?

Who'd have thunk it

Dinosaurs a bit strong, but at the end of the day he's won the community shield in the whole of his managerial career with arguably the biggest club in the Prem if not the world..
He's recruited really well so far, he's got us fit and commited to the cause.
He deserves great credit for what he has done this season, but he is not winning anything again this year except plaudits.
Out of all the old same old same old managers out there, he is probably the best fit, because we need someone who won't take any shit.
If he starts bringing in silverware, or at least having a go at winning something and not surrendering like he did against the Mancs, then he will win over the fans, supporters whatever you want to call them.
Can he repeat or even better the standards of this season, next season, with fans back in the grounds?. This is West Ham after all.

That kind of attitude of only rating managers who have won something before is why we were saddled with Pellegrini.

[Castiron]

Dinosaurs a bit strong, but at the end of the day he's won the community shield in the whole of his managerial career with arguably the biggest club in the Prem if not the world..
He's recruited really well so far, he's got us fit and commited to the cause.
He deserves great credit for what he has done this season, but he is not winning anything again this year except plaudits.
Out of all the old same old same old managers out there, he is probably the best fit, because we need someone who won't take any shit.
If he starts bringing in silverware, or at least having a go at winning something and not surrendering like he did against the Mancs, then he will win over the fans, supporters whatever you want to call them.
Can he repeat or even better the standards of this season, next season, with fans back in the grounds?. This is West Ham after all.

That kind of attitude of only rating managers who have won something before is why we were saddled with Pellegrini.

Your opinion. So what is the point then?.
What is the end goal of a football team?.
In my book to win something.
Go and ask Ferguson why he was in the game. Go and ask Pep why he is in the game.
Go and ask any player why they play the game.
Go and ask if the Everton fans are happy that Moyes kept them in the top ten most seasons but won fuck all.
I like what Moyes is doing thus far, but he is still a manager who has won fuck all in the game. If he can deliver trophies then I will like him even more.
He won't be remembered for finishing 5th or 6th, but would be if we lifted a trophy.

[Whiskyman]

That kind of attitude of only rating managers who have won something before is why we were saddled with Pellegrini.

Your opinion. So what is the point then?.
What is the end goal of a football team?.
In my book to win something.
Go and ask Ferguson why he was in the game. Go and ask Pep why he is in the game.
Go and ask any player why they play the game.
Go and ask if the Everton fans are happy that Moyes kept them in the top ten most seasons but won fuck all.
I like what Moyes is doing thus far, but he is still a manager who has won fuck all in the game. If he can deliver trophies then I will like him even more.
He won't be remembered for finishing 5th or 6th, but would be if we lifted a trophy.

There are only 2 major trophies that matter in today's football. The Premier League and then, for those that can qualify, the Champions League. The fans may love the F A Cup, and some even like the Mickey Mouse but for most managers, and probably top players, they are an inconvenience. In any case most years one of the Champions League qualifiers win the things anyway.

If Pep Guardiola was West Ham's coach would we suddenly win the league ? No. Would he improve the side ? Probably yes. But because he would lack the resources of the teams he is competing with the chances of actually winning would be very slim.

Imo Moyes has improved the side significantly and has also achieved near miracles in the transfer market. £5 million for Coufal stands very well alongside the money Chelsea paid for Chilwell imo. £15 million for Soucek compares very favourably with the money Man United shelled out for Donny van de Beek. And as for Dawson who apparently will be available for around £3 million , would anyone think we'd have been better off paying £70 million for Harry Maguire ? Unlikely I think.

I actually disagree with your last point. If we qualify for Europe Moyes will certainly receive, and deserve, a lot of credit from us supporters. Let's face it it's possible to win a cup with a lucky run of fixtures. FFS it's not even necessary to win all your games if you have enough players who hold their nerve during a penalty shoot out,.Finishing in a European spot illustrates a club's achievement over the season as a whole, not in a handful of games against the likes of Stockport and Doncaster.

I will be the first to admit Moyes wouldn't have been my choice of manager first time around. He would, however, have got my vote second time. Frankly I find it difficult to understand the criticism of so called negative tactics. Imo, at least, we are playing some of the most watchable TEAM football we have seen for a long time. Sure we have in the past enjoyed moments of magic from gifted individuals like Payet , di Canio and company but this is, at least imo, the best West Ham TEAM since 1986. And that is high praise.

I'm actually looking forward to the game against City. I don't expect us to win but I do expect us to give them a game. And for me it's nice to be looking at a game like that not expecting a timid and effete capitulation which we've all seen many times in the past when the going got a bit tough,.

[Castiron]

Your opinion. So what is the point then?.
What is the end goal of a football team?.
In my book to win something.
Go and ask Ferguson why he was in the game. Go and ask Pep why he is in the game.
Go and ask any player why they play the game.
Go and ask if the Everton fans are happy that Moyes kept them in the top ten most seasons but won fuck all.
I like what Moyes is doing thus far, but he is still a manager who has won fuck all in the game. If he can deliver trophies then I will like him even more.
He won't be remembered for finishing 5th or 6th, but would be if we lifted a trophy.

There are only 2 major trophies that matter in today's football. The Premier League and then, for those that can qualify, the Champions League. The fans may love the F A Cup, and some even like the Mickey Mouse but for most managers, and probably top players, they are an inconvenience. In any case most years one of the Champions League qualifiers win the things anyway.

If Pep Guardiola was West Ham's coach would we suddenly win the league ? No. Would he improve the side ? Probably yes. But because he would lack the resources of the teams he is competing with the chances of actually winning would be very slim.

Imo Moyes has improved the side significantly and has also achieved near miracles in the transfer market. £5 million for Coufal stands very well alongside the money Chelsea paid for Chilwell imo. £15 million for Soucek compares very favourably with the money Man United shelled out for Donny van de Beek. And as for Dawson who apparently will be available for around £3 million , would anyone think we'd have been better off paying £70 million for Harry Maguire ? Unlikely I think.

I actually disagree with your last point. If we qualify for Europe Moyes will certainly receive, and deserve, a lot of credit from us supporters. Let's face it it's possible to win a cup with a lucky run of fixtures. FFS it's not even necessary to win all your games if you have enough players who hold their nerve during a penalty shoot out,.Finishing in a European spot illustrates a club's achievement over the season as a whole, not in a handful of games against the likes of Stockport and Doncaster.

I will be the first to admit Moyes wouldn't have been my choice of manager first time around. He would, however, have got my vote second time. Frankly I find it difficult to understand the criticism of so called negative tactics. Imo, at least, we are playing some of the most watchable TEAM football we have seen for a long time. Sure we have in the past enjoyed moments of magic from gifted individuals like Payet , di Canio and company but this is, at least imo, the best West Ham TEAM since 1986. And that is high praise.

I'm actually looking forward to the game against City. I don't expect us to win but I do expect us to give them a game. And for me it's nice to be looking at a game like that not expecting a timid and effete capitulation which we've all seen many times in the past when the going got a bit tough,.

I'm looking forward to City aswell, as long as he doesn't set up like he did against Liverpool, Man Utd, Chelsea.
I don't want to see a backs to the wall performance of our own doing.
I think David Moyes would be very happy to win the FA Cup and finish in the top ten with us, that's realistically all he can hope for.

[h69]

That kind of attitude of only rating managers who have won something before is why we were saddled with Pellegrini.

Your opinion. So what is the point then?.
What is the end goal of a football team?.
In my book to win something.
Go and ask Ferguson why he was in the game. Go and ask Pep why he is in the game.
Go and ask any player why they play the game.
Go and ask if the Everton fans are happy that Moyes kept them in the top ten most seasons but won fuck all.
I like what Moyes is doing thus far, but he is still a manager who has won fuck all in the game. If he can deliver trophies then I will like him even more.
He won't be remembered for finishing 5th or 6th, but would be if we lifted a trophy.

He will be by me if he can consistently finish in the top 6 or 7. I want us to compete, that is all I ask. A few years of being up the top, enjoying results rather than looking at relegation I would love.

I dont doubt that winning something is the be-all and end-all to some people just for the day out but the point is that Moyes is more likely to win a cup with our squad and budget than Pellegrini ever is. Their performances as managers at other clubs is not an indicator in any way shape or form as far as a cup goes. We were suckered with that naive view with Pellegrini. He was never going to win anything with us but had with other teams.

That said, this demand that we win a trophy is infantile. Of course we all want us to win one but how many trophies have been won by teams outside the so called top 4 or 5 in the last 15 years. By your example, do you think that Nuno has been a failure at Wolves ? Rodgers at Leicester ? If Everton finish 5th this season under Ancelotti do you think they will see him as a failure ?

The fact that you expect us to have the same expectation as Ferguson and Pep is frankly laughable. Go and look at the Spurs forum to show how happy they are with their serial winner and they are in a League cup final. Granted they have not won it yet but they seem to prefer top 4 and Champions League qualification and they have not won anything in 20 years.

Everton.....a team that got rid of Moyes despite him keeping them up the top of the league reasonably consistently because they felt they should be winning trophies and got in Martinez, Allardyce and Koeman. How has that worked out for them ?? They say they got Koeman in to turn Everton into Barca but he has turned Barca into Everton

I personally want to see us compete in the league. I'd love to win an FA cup or a League cup but that is very difficult to do nowadays, unlike the old days, the gap between us and Liverpool, City, Arsenal and Chelsea in finances is why they almost always mop up the cups.

As far as setting up against the big clubs...Moyes, himself said he was not happy with the way the team backed off against Liverpool, The team he put out was offensive enough but they were scared...that was down to the players to be honest.

As far as players. I would think nearly every one of them would rather play in the CL than win an FA or League cup medal. Every one. If they say otherwise they are lying. It is not the romantic view that fans have but it is the way the game is these days. It raises their profile (and earning potential).

We have a goal difference of +10. That is not a negative team.

This is not the 80s.

[Castiron]

Your opinion. So what is the point then?.
What is the end goal of a football team?.
In my book to win something.
Go and ask Ferguson why he was in the game. Go and ask Pep why he is in the game.
Go and ask any player why they play the game.
Go and ask if the Everton fans are happy that Moyes kept them in the top ten most seasons but won fuck all.
I like what Moyes is doing thus far, but he is still a manager who has won fuck all in the game. If he can deliver trophies then I will like him even more.
He won't be remembered for finishing 5th or 6th, but would be if we lifted a trophy.

He will be by me if he can consistently finish in the top 6 or 7. I want us to compete, that is all I ask. A few years of being up the top, enjoying results rather than looking at relegation I would love.

I dont doubt that winning something is the be-all and end-all to some people just for the day out but the point is that Moyes is more likely to win a cup with our squad and budget than Pellegrini ever is. Their performances as managers at other clubs is not an indicator in any way shape or form as far as a cup goes. We were suckered with that naive view with Pellegrini. He was never going to win anything with us but had with other teams.

That said, this demand that we win a trophy is infantile. Of course we all want us to win one but how many trophies have been won by teams outside the so called top 4 or 5 in the last 15 years. By your example, do you think that Nuno has been a failure at Wolves ? Rodgers at Leicester ? If Everton finish 5th this season under Ancelotti do you think they will see him as a failure ?

The fact that you expect us to have the same expectation as Ferguson and Pep is frankly laughable. Go and look at the Spurs forum to show how happy they are with their serial winner and they are in a League cup final. Granted they have not won it yet but they seem to prefer top 4 and Champions League qualification and they have not won anything in 20 years.

Everton.....a team that got rid of Moyes despite him keeping them up the top of the league reasonably consistently because they felt they should be winning trophies and got in Martinez, Allardyce and Koeman. How has that worked out for them ?? They say they got Koeman in to turn Everton into Barca but he has turned Barca into Everton

I personally want to see us compete in the league. I'd love to win an FA cup or a League cup but that is very difficult to do nowadays, unlike the old days, the gap between us and Liverpool, City, Arsenal and Chelsea in finances is why they almost always mop up the cups.

As far as setting up against the big clubs...Moyes, himself said he was not happy with the way the team backed off against Liverpool, The team he put out was offensive enough but they were scared...that was down to the players to be honest.

As far as players. I would think nearly every one of them would rather play in the CL than win an FA or League cup medal. Every one. If they say otherwise they are lying. It is not the romantic view that fans have but it is the way the game is these days. It raises their profile (and earning potential).

We have a goal difference of +10. That is not a negative team.

This is not the 80s.

As I said it's your opinion.
I haven't watched a Champions league game for 2 years at a guess, could be longer, as it bores me to death. Champions League has no appeal to me whatsoever.
Do you think we will win the Champions League with Moyes?. If yes, then pass me some of what you are smoking.
If no, then what is the point of getting all excited about getting there
We could possibly have a go in the Europa if he keeps building, but I doubt it.
As for the players being scared of Liverpool ffs, if that's the case the buck stops firmly with the manager on that one.
A team that didn't have a recognised center back to call on, and we were scared
They totally outplayed us and made us look like the West Ham of old.
As for Ancelotti, if I was an Everton fan, I would be very disappointed if he didn't win anything there.
They've spent the money.
So I'm living in the eighties because I want West Ham to actually fucking win something,
Jog on mate ffs